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Dirkdiggler
04-25-2008, 12:33 PM
Feral builds
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Mainly aimed at feral PvE.. I have gone into other tree's as seemed fit. I would appreciate other views as we have some experianced druids here


Restoration tree
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Tier 1
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IMOTW
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This is a ultimate no-no. If you touch this as a feral I will take you to one side and set Mr Norris on you. "Back in the day" this was godly, lvls 1-50 it is supreme, lv 60 it is good. lvl 70 it sucks more balls than julian clary.

For example.. Raid buffed, kings gives me 4% dodge, 1.5k Health, 200+ac, 200ish AP
the full 5 points this gives me is worth and extra 0.35% dodge, 100Hp, 21 AP......

Furor
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If this was claculated client side, this would be one of the first things to get nerfed. As it is it is very good, and by far the best "1st tier" talent you can chhose.. you need to get to teh 2nd tier of this tree to get access to:

Tier 2
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Naturilst
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GODLY.. nuff said..+10% flat dmg increase, increases threat, increases DPS.. take it.. all 5.. take them now !!!


Natures focus
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OK if you are PvP feral, depending on role and situation, if you are a PvE feral, and you are finding that you *need* this talent.. then I suggest you look at what you are trying t do with your druid...

Natural shapeshifter
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There has been more arguments over this, than I don't know what !! A lot of people consider this s PvP only talent... however I really like it.

If you are a on a RP server , then I suggest you get in charecter and get this :).. if you are a focussed raid MT.. the number 1 meat shield.. then TBH irrespective of your mana pool.. you will not be shifting anywhere.. so I would not take it.

If you PvP a lot, this is godly.. take it..

general PvE raiding.... playstyle dependant... Personally I like it, as I like to consider myself as a flexable DPS supporting OT. I like the fact I can shift, and shift often, and becuase if you find yourslef caught in caster form == you dead then being able to shift often, and quickly from oom situations for me is irreplacable.

On Hydross, I shift at least 2ce on each add wave (not including BR's innervates etc). On Naj'entus I shift 2ce per shield (bear for the sheild, cat for DPS), plus I try to heal also.. 30% more mana (which is what this equates to..) for me is not to be sniffed at.. at the 6k mana mark.. thats the same as an extra 2k more mana..

Tier 3
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Omen of clarity..
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A bigger DPS boost than you think (same argument as 2*T4 which we will not cover here), and very very good for threat. for 1 pt, its a very very good talent.. just remember to buff yourself with it (and not invite people into the raid by accident)

Subelty
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no.... just ... no.. if you need to know why "no" then come and speak to me and we will visit Mr Norris


Intensity
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Another "debating" talent. If you run lots of 5-mans / heroics where you could be called up to secondary heal.. then this tlent works really well. Also this ties in very nicley wih your enrage, generating 12 extra free rage (almost) instantly. As you go up the instance tree, the enrage portion becomes more a playstyle thing, and you heal less, and less.

No-one will complain if you take it.. no-one will complain if you don't

I will go no deeper, as any deeper and you will find yourself spending too many points in here.

Dirkdiggler
04-25-2008, 12:33 PM
Balance
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OK.. only 1 talant worth discussing. Naturs grasp. For 1 talent point it adds 25% to your PvP viability since it is now castable in forms.. Any more, and you are creating a PvP not a PvE build If you have a totally different PvP to PvE build and respec between the 2, then dont take it as you will (almost) never use it in instances, and raid mobs are immue to it anyways.. if like me you don't want to keep repseccing then for 1 point.. go-on.. spoil yourself.


Feral
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OK.. descision time.. ARE you primarily a DPS / MT / OT-DPS hybrid..
I personally would only spend 5 points on the first tier (unless you find yourself with spare ones), and I would fill out wichever one you choose to teh max

Ferocity
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Best of teh 2 IMO, ignoring rake (never used) the rage reduction of this baby is awesome for tanks.. for threat, for pussy -cats it allows you to do an instant mangle after a powershift (if you have taken furor).

Feral agression
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Not worth it IMO the decrease in boss AP is not worth the points (for 5-mans you prob want the to hit harder anyway for rage), and the dmg increase on FB is only really worth it for PvP and large numbers on the curator or 1st Heroic mech boss or Akama. Normal DPS rotations do not include FB.


Feral instinct
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If you tank... take this talent in its fullness.. peroid. If you PvP.. take this talent for stealthy-stealthy. If only PVE-DPS (lucky you) then optional.


Brutal impact
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Considered a PvP talent by many, and a very good one at that. In 5-mans and heroics, works well as a tank there as your only form of mob CC. never used in raids.


Thick hide
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there are many discussions about AC value diminishing returns, however the simple argument is, if you are tanking in raids.. and if you are less than about 30000ac raid buffed.. take this talent...


Feral swiftness
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Dodge is the primary tanking stat for a bear tank.. here have a flat 6% increase.... oo go on then.. :).. in summary.. take this talent. Plus it makes you faster outside and yes it does stack with other speed increases.

Feral charge
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Awesome. In PvP it has cuased more whines than the south of france. In PvE being able to get to a rogue mob (and if in teh right level of dungeun stun it) is invaluluble.. al this for 1 point.. it is madness not to consider it

Shapened claws
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Godly.. extra crit = massive DPS boost for cat, more threat in bear, more ILotP procs in both forms.. take this talent.. PLUS its a feeder to the other no-brainer talent..on the next tier

Primal fury
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Really good talent. for 2 talent points you get free rage every crit, or extra combo pints. Combo points = huge DPS boost, free rage = huge threat boost. you had better have a *really* good reason not to spend 2 points here as a PvE Tank / DPS

Shredding attacks
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Shred is your primary DPS move.. 18 enery is massive.. Not taking this talent is like blowing your leg off to climb mount everest just to prove you can...Oh it also affects lacerate.. and now that lacerte scales with AP.. thsi talent just got even better.

Preditory strikes
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If you are feral.. take this. Individually this talent sucks more balls than JClary (him again?) it works out to a flat.. unscalabe, unbuffable whopping 105 AP increase for 3.. yes.. 3 talent points.... thanks bliz.. whopping-fepping-do, could theer be a worse, mandatory, talent point sink in the entire game... answers on a post card pls.

Leads to:

Heart of the wild..
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Blizz made this talent so good to compensate to the bum-buggering you have just taken to get here...I won't go into teh arguments, but take this talent.. take it now !! all the points.. yes it *is* that good.

Nurturing instinct
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This is a very intresting talent now post 2.4. Before it was, what we will now call, a julian clary talent, but now its very interesting. For example. In my Tank / DPS gera I have about +550 - +650 heal. with my healing weps.. I now have +1000 heal... TBH that is not too shabby. +20% (and ILotP is affected too) heal when I am in kitty forms makes it really easy to keep me alive. In PvP this is now an awesoem talent, if you are luck enough to have 2*T5 for the set bonus.. cat DPS.. insta cast 2.5k (crit) rej whcih now ticks for 1k over 12 secs, shift back.. DPS again.... in what way is that not good?

For teh PvE Purist, how much healing does a feral actually do (ignoring naj'entus and PvP), and it is not affected in bear, so useless for tanking.

I like it.. I use it.. its up to you and your playstyle. I like the fact I can heal..


Savage fury
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A cat DPS talent only, and possibly a PvP one at that. Claw/ rake you should never use, unless you want to put a bleed on a rogue, in a true DPS rotation anyway so its 2 talents to increase by 20% a DPS only attack that constitues ~ 1/10 of your overal raid boss DPS.

FFF
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Awesome talent... wether it should be our 21pt talent or not is under debate.. but its +650 ArP, annoys rogues in PvP, and a free no rage, no mana ranged pull... yes you get all this in caster form.. but now its in new-improved big bear form :)

Survival of the fittest.
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Mandatory if you are a druid tank. If you dont take this.. re-roll a rogue. Sorry if that sounds harsh.. but its true. Without this you will gimp yourself so much in later runs that you might as well take part in a nightime orienteering competition, with no moon, in the middle of a dark forest, with black maps, no lights, no compass and only a silent whistle to help you......


Primal tenacity
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3% stun fear resit.......hmmmm.... Technically a good talent for a tank.. but with the new fear - aggro mechanics, no longer a needed talent. Raid fights are balanced for tanks without it anyways. NIce For PvP however.



LoTP / ILoTP
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This is the definition of a druid.. the "feral buff" one of the sole reasons you are included in a melee DPS group. The party wide 5% crit buff is sought after by hunter, melee shammys, rogues, warriors.. Improved.. if you have come this far... then take it.. it actually is a REALLY nice talent.. it makes grinding a joke.. I often find myslef healing up for more dmg than I am taking, which means you can grind......forever................................ Also on raid boss fights.. do not underestimate the amount of healing you do to your party..It is not insignificant.


Preditory instincts
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Flat 10% dmg increase.....also has an AoE component associated with it.. Godly for PvP, the Dmg increase alone makes it almost mandatory for PvE


Mangle
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Mandatory.. defines a feral duid. Tanking without it is like (see everest analogy, or orienteering one.. which ever floats your boat) DPS'ing without it is even worse...

Dirkdiggler
04-25-2008, 12:33 PM
reserved

Dirkdiggler
04-25-2008, 12:34 PM
reserved again

Bokeh
04-25-2008, 12:51 PM
Just a quick reaction to the feral talents: No serious raiding prot warrior will have improved demoralizing shout unless you're a dedicated offtank spec, and fury warriors usually don't have it either.

Dirkdiggler
04-25-2008, 01:52 PM
Just a quick reaction to the feral talents: No serious raiding prot warrior will have improved demoralizing shout unless you're a dedicated offtank spec, and fury warriors usually don't have it either.

Good point.. Tool -tip updated.. position on its viability IMO still stands.

Bokeh
04-25-2008, 03:21 PM
yeah definetely there's a reason warriors don't take it either.

Girlmagic
04-25-2008, 03:22 PM
stickied